Pahokee INTERVIEW

Co-Directed by Patrick Bresnan and Ivete Lucas, Pahokee is an intimate documentary sharing the lives of four seniors at Pahokee High School as they go through their first love, a popularity contest, teen parenting, intense personal struggles, and hardships experienced together as a community. This is Lucas and Bresnan’s third film made in Pahokee, FL, and their first feature. Pahokee premiered at this year’s Sundance Film Festival.

Website: https://www.pahokeefilm.com/the-film

Dawn: On my way to your screening I was going with a friend unfamiliar with your work, and I used the term “observational documentary.” Then during your guys’ Q&A, my whole concept of what I had previously known about that had shifted. I was hoping you guys could talk to me about how you guys feel about that word and ethnographic film and why you guys don’t fit into that.

Patrick: We’re not anthropologists. We don’t want anyone we’re recording to feel like they’re being studied.

Ivete: I don’t think there’s something inherently wrong with observational cinema.

P: No, not all at.

I: I think that observational cinema can have its place. I believe that some of the work we’ve done, like Roadside Attraction, our short, I would call that observational cinema. The camera is totally observant. And we don’t know the people we’re observing in that film. But I think specifically for the work we’re doing in Pahokee and intimately with kids, teenagers and with community is where we don’t specifically want to describe it as observational because we’re not sitting there and observing them.

P: We think a lot about people from Pahokee or wherever we’re working reading about a film and reading that the people filming them were observational filmmakers. And observation...you know I love observing birds. But I think it would be really uncomfortable to read about a film that you’re in, and you’re really excited about, and to call your life ethnographic. And your friends, who are recording you, which we really become close with the people we’re working with, to not think of us as friends but as like these people observing you. We’re not trying to, we don’t want to study people. We want to tell a story with them. It’s very collaborative. They have to allow us to film. Observation feels like a security camera.

I: I think the word is a bit “othering.” Like I am here and I have this role to observe you. Or ethnographic divides us into two categories. Like I’m here to study your ethnic expression. It doesn't feel like it describes what we do. It’s very collaborative but it’s also messier than that. We’re friends. For us, our human relationships are the most important thing from the start. Making friends and having real relationships with people comes first and then the film comes after. What we’re trying to do is have a very intimate, very present-tense, immediate experience with the audience. We’re not outside looking towards people, we’re fully in with everybody.

D: I noticed in a lot of the shots how comfortable the subjects were with you guys. I could see for example subjects getting closer to the camera or clearly you had permission to move about their house because you were able to follow them from room to room. One of the things I was wondering about your closeness - if it would be ok to talk about a time that maybe you are in that close space with them maybe at home or something, and they were dealing with something where you thought it was better to put the camera down and experience that moment with them as a human versus a filmmaker?

P: I feel like you walk a really tight line sometimes and you just have to know when not to record and to be present.

I: And that’s not to say that we shied away from hard things, I mean you see in the film that we have the shooting and we have different things that are hard. But at that moment, you know, it helps to be sure of what you’re doing.

D: I’m curious how you guys as filmmakers being so close to these kids and their families, with all of these things happening to them, how you guys handle these really emotional things. Obviously you guys have your own personal lives too, and when you’re involved in these other people’s lives and when they’re going through such difficult times, how does that affect you and how do you balance all of those things?

P: You just put your personal life on hold, really. We were living in Pahokee for 9 months and what we really enjoyed doing to get a break was walking along Lake Okeechobee at night and just watching birds and alligators.

I: Walking our dog.

P: You get a six pack after the football game on Friday night and you just drink until you fall asleep and then you start over again.

D: I was curious about the editing choices. There was so much humor in the editing. From the two other films that I’ve seen from you guys, I didn’t really ever see that from you before.

I: I think then maybe we can talk a little bit about the positive connotation of the word of “observation.” Aso “sensitivity” as a word. The factor of coming in and recording and knowing that you’re not gonna ascribe your ideas or tone to something. I’m from Latin America and sometimes I see films about things that were hard and the films were hard. And the tones were devastating and sad and I’m like that’s not reality. That’s not what my life is like. There’s a lot of humor in my life and we have a lot of fun. And even through hard times and not having money for this or that, like we still figure it out and are human. So I think coming in and knowing that you’re there to take in everything and be sensitive and honor the truth that emerged in front of you, that’s how I edit. And I think that’s how Patrick shoots. And the truth is that teenage years are fun and wild and kids are sometimes awkward, so it does tend to show a little humor.

D: Is there anything that wasn’t brought up that you wanted to add?

I: You said you were interested in the experience of viewing things together, I think that the screenings that we had at Sundance were really amazing. It is a film where people cry but it’s also a film where people cry at the Q&A. The connection between demographics that are not usually even hanging out together...that was really beautiful.

Sundance does this thing where they do screenings for high schoolers.

P: There were 300 inner city kids from Salt Lake City.

I: We wanted to make sure that this film was artful and smart and everything, but also really accessible for teenagers. It’s so important for them to take this film and make it theirs. The moment that the film ended, it was like, applause and whistling and howling. I mean it was incredible. I feel like, for the kids to watch it together, because a lot of young kids of color approached us and cried and told us that that’s what their life is like and that they’ve never seen it portrayed like that in films. And that it made them feel proud of who they are, and brave. And I think if they had watched it by themselves and felt that, that’s one thing, but they watched it in this hall with all these other kids. And suddenly they’re sitting side-by-side and they’re going through this experience together and this kid is looking at this other kid and going “oh wow” like I understand you better. That’s really powerful.